Any honest ones out there?

[dougie]

I love reading the many posts about the "issues" surrounding harness racing's owners, trainer. and drivers. I've heard people talk about, drugging horses, using "beards", and killing horses. So my question to all is very simple. Are there any honest people in our sport? Or are they all lying, cheating, scumbags?

[The Thorn]

Remember what I said about you being a one percenter?  That just about says it all 

[rainman2]

I love reading the many posts about the "issues" surrounding harness racing's owners, trainer. and drivers. I've heard people talk about, drugging horses, using "beards", and killing horses. So my question ro all is very simple. Are there any honest people in our sport. Or are they all lying, cheating, scumbags?

I guess I picked the right trainers!  Never had a serious issue about what Dougie posted above!  I believe he has met 1 of my trainers, if not both of them!

[dougie]

Thorn, thanks! But there has to be honest folks in their biz. If not, why would any of us waste money betting?

[MIKE CAMPBELL]

If you are looking for an honest trainer, just look at the trainer standings at whichever track you are interested in and scroll down to the trainers with win percentages in the single digits. They are the honest ones.

[Any1Left]

almost zero percent 100 percent honesty in this game,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,I HAVE KNOWN MANY GROOMS THAT WORK FOR HUGE DRUG TRAINERS AND THEY REALLY BELIEVE ITS HAY AND OATES AND MANY OWNERS BELIEVE THE SAME,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Honesty is trying to win and not giving a horse a race and you would have to go back to JOE O BRIEN to find that,,,,,,,,,,Honesty is never giving up a hole for no reason,,,,,,,,,,testing clean means nothing as Lance Armstrong admitted that he always used and was only caught twice and always tested clean,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Honesty is knowing that the fans of the sport work for their money and to give every owner the best possible chance to win,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, The only sport on the planet were the worker being the driver is the total boss and can not be told how to drive is harness racing,,,,,,,,,,,In tb racing a jockey giving a poor ride will have remorse and tell the owner and trainer he messed up but in harness racing their is no remorse,,,,,,,,,,, i have had fair treatment from some but i am still aware that it is most likely my trainer is looking for an edge,,,,,,,,,,,,, Simple ,,,hay and oats  people do not win and that is why the familys who have had generations of top stakes horses has ended and todays top trainers have bills that   are a joke,,,,,,,,,

[mwins]

If you ain't cheating, you ain't trying.

[The Thorn]

Thorn, thanks! But there has to be honest folks in their biz. If not, why would any of us waste money betting?

Boredom, Force of Habit, Satisfaction from a win, and of course being a degenerate gambler. 

Seriously though back in the 70s and 80s when drivers were the main cheaters my top win bet was $200 which had no effect on the odds.  In today's money that is over $750.  You can't bet that much now without dramatically changing the odds in 99% of the races.   That's why it's a "dying game" and the majority of cheating has changed to vets and drug led.  You can't make money betting against algorithms with small pools.  If you don't cheat for the purses you might as well go on welfare for real.

[dougie]

Thorn, that's a sad commentary on our sport. I had 4 cheap claimers in the early 80's at Pompano Park. My trainer, who never had more than 6 in his barn did most of the work with his wife. He was always "tight" with money, and never gouged us on the bills. The only time he ever used a "groom" was when we had one racing. He was a great guy. Sadly, my partners and I rarely made any money, and wound up getting out of the business. I guess if my trainer and driver cheated, we'd have done better. Like I said.....a sad commentary.

[okdfool]

I love reading the many posts about the "issues" surrounding harness racing's owners, trainer. and drivers. I've heard people talk about, drugging horses, using "beards", and killing horses. So my question to all is very simple. Are there any honest people in our sport? Or are they all lying, cheating, scumbags?

There’s still a good old fashioned guys around but they mostly are not taking in new owners

[kooter for hipin]

I love reading the many posts about the "issues" surrounding harness racing's owners, trainer. and drivers. I've heard people talk about, drugging horses, using "beards", and killing horses. So my question to all is very simple. Are there any honest people in our sport? Or are they all lying, cheating, scumbags?

No! They are  basically all scumbags. I should Know. Except for the killing, I was one.   

[Grandstand Handicapper]

As far as owners, if you are going to condemn them for who they pick as a trainer, then you are going to have a much smaller group. Ironically, on that original list that showed the clients/buyers, there were a lot of owners, but that place sold a lot of legal, legit products too. The list that Gural used...I don't remember off the top of my head and I will have to go back and look at it...but were there any other owners on that list in addition to Taylor.

I always thought George Segal was an upstanding guy. I didn't like that early on they picked the ones to keep and sold the rest, but later on they started selling everything except a filly or two to keep in the farm's broodmare band. I always thought Ted Gewertz and Marty Granoff were upstanding guys. There are others as well.

Trainers and drivers, I'll let that topic go, LOL.

[Kirbys Ace]

The sport is dead. If it wasn't for welfare from the casino money 90% of tracks would fold. If you can't see it's on life support by now, then there's no helping it. Only future is to work on it to make it more independent sustainable.

[Arnold Ziffel]

There’s still a good old fashioned guys around but they mostly are not taking in new owners

really like who?