Karl

[Grandstand Handicapper]

He’s a double millionaire Breeders Crown and Hambletonian winner. 2 races Greenshoe never won who stands for $25k

his stud career is set in stone

Keep something else in mind. He had an amazing 2yo year. Was light years ahead of the entire class, except, maybe, TCI some might argue. Regardless, now look at what happened at 3.....look at what breeders are going to see.....not people voting for HOTY, but breeders, look at what they look at. His 3yo year completely changed the perception and direction this colt's career was going in from a stallion perspective.

[Parked]

Many years ago a very smart horseman told me.  “Speed can come from anywhere but soundness is bred in.  “

[Sweet Louis]

Good Lord to say Art Official had a worse trip shows you will say anything to try and make your statement sound believable....the horse was bred in Canada so why wouldn't he race alot up there...they have a great sire program and big money races on their own....like others said if they were scared of competition they wouldn't have ran Yonkers in a monsoon.

[Grandstand Handicapper]

Many years ago a very smart horseman told me.  “Speed can come from anywhere but soundness is bred in.  “

Very insightful. Profound. Thought provoking too, LOL. Who was it that said that?

[Call Sign Merlin]

Many years ago a very smart horseman told me.  “Speed can come from anywhere but soundness is bred in.  “

Most of the Tactical Landings we have had - especially the more light bodied ones - have had soundness issues.  People have has lots of success with them but we have not

[Parked]

Very insightful. Profound. Thought provoking too, LOL. Who was it that said that?

U C Steele
One day he was talking breeding , was well into his 80’s, and someone said “you are looking out pretty far”. He replied that he fully expected to live to be 100 and active.   He passed at 99. 

[Grandstand Handicapper]

U C Steele
One day he was talking breeding , was well into his 80’s, and someone said “you are looking out pretty far”. He replied that he fully expected to live to be 100 and active.   He passed at 99.

That's great. Lyss! I really liked that guy! I met him a few times and we stayed in touch. He was a very sharp owner. Sharp breeder. Very astute, and a good judge of horseflesh. At one time he named every horse he bred with the first letter S. A really nice man.

[Grandstand Handicapper]

SBSW raced 15 times at 3. Not a "full" schedule, but certainly not babied. I would say babied is 10 to 12 starts and skipping one or two real majors---the NA Cup or the Meadowlands Pace, avoiding a half completely, and possibly ducking specific horses. At 2 he was 6 for 6 and raced in the Nassagaweya and the Champlain which are not slouch races, the Battle of Waterloo---elimination and final (which has become a far more prestigious Canadian, and in recent years has attracted horses from the US, but that's irrelevant here) and let's not forget the most prestigious race for 2yo's anywhere, the $1mm Metro, elimination and final.

At 3, he danced at won every race except the one-----both OSS Gold/Super Finals (only an idiot would skip those, remember, this is about making money, LOL, and nothing is better than easier money, LOL), the Simcoe, the Burlington, the Confederation Cup (elimination and final) the elimination and final of the NA Cup, the Meadowlands Pace, the Messenger, and for those of you who ONLY WATCH THE TELETIMER, he set a WR in the Bluegrass (146.4). Was it the fullest dance card, no, but he will be considered as one of the greatest, if not the greatest, horse of modern times. Certainly since Niatross and I would go back before that. SBSW will make the top 10 GOAT of any true expert in the sport.

Yes, he lost the Meadowlands Pace. That didn't subtract from his career or greatness, it defined it. SBSW didn't lose to a better horse. Nobody is going to say Art Official was a better horse. He simply wasn't. SBSW got a pretty unfavorable drive and trip and got beat by a horse who had a better trip. Not perfect, but better. Art Official had an excellent career, but his victory over a truly great horse doesn't make him a greater horse. Art Official won what---12 or 13 races out of 20 as a 3yo? Dominant? People say he was in a different division in the Bluegrass, yes that's true. SBSW went in 146.4 and Art Official went in 1:48.3 (just a side note for all of you who ONLY WATCH THE TELETIMER, LOL). Come on, set aside your own disappointments, frustrations, whatever. Owners who manage champions will disappoint you every day, LOL.

[lost cause]

lets all be honest the only reason sbsw lost the meds pace is paul macdonel.worst trip since titanic.my question is how good was sbsw to carry that anchor around and only lose once

[JT]

This thread has totally gone off the rails. It was a thread about Karl and he and SBSW shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence. If it wasn't for MacDonnell he would have been perfect. Ask anyone under the age of 40.. if there are any that young that follow harness racing..LOL and 90% would say SBSW is the goat.. regardless of gait. The other 10 percent would be split amongst Muscle Hill, Artsplace etc....

[JT]

lets all be honest the only reason sbsw lost the meds pace is paul macdonel.worst trip since titanic.my question is how good was sbsw to carry that anchor around and only lose once

.. What I had just finished typing.

[Grandstand Handicapper]

lets all be honest the only reason sbsw lost the meds pace is paul macdonel.worst trip since titanic.my question is how good was sbsw to carry that anchor around and only lose once

LOL (Titanic). Good one. Listen, I always liked Paul. I think he's one of the real good guys of our sport and he's a good horseman. I won't say anything bad about him, but that's just because I like him and I respect him. Yes, he gave him a very tough drive, rough, etc. Think about it this way, even with that, he almost pulled it off, LOL, and the horse that beat him was the only horse that possibly could. Better decision making by Ron Pierce, ingenious perhaps, LOL. Better trip, perfect trip to beat SBSW.

Paul felt bad about the race. Really bad. He took the blame upon himself. He felt bad for the horse and the owners, and also the sport. But races get run and that one went the way it went.

[Grandstand Handicapper]

This thread has totally gone off the rails. It was a thread about Karl and he and SBSW shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence. If it wasn't for MacDonnell he would have been perfect. Ask anyone under the age of 40.. if there are any that young that follow harness racing..LOL and 90% would say SBSW is the goat.. regardless of gait. The other 10 percent would be split amongst Muscle Hill, Artsplace etc....

Excellent points.

[Grandstand Handicapper]

this is so ridiculous

Somebeachsomewher e is among the greatest of all time. So what he skipped the Jug

Agreed.

[rainman2]

IMO,

Over the years, many trainers were not concerned about the Little Brown Jug as a priority on their agendas.  A 1–2-mile track, decreasing purses, and heat racing were perhaps 'valid reasons' in their thought processes.